B3: Community Meeting Report — original pdf

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Zilker Cafe Conditional Use Permit Community Meeting Question Report Report Generated: 6/17/2021 7:50:00 PM Webinar ID: 922 2541 4736 Actual Start Time: 6/17/2021 5:01:00 PM Actual Duration (minutes): 152 # Question: 159 Question Details # Question 1 Will we be able to see all participants? 2 I didn’t hear the answer to Patricia’s question. Will we be able to see all participants? Are we going to be able to see who is in attendance? And are we muted? 3 Asker Email (redacted) Answer(s) live answered Asker Name Patricia Bobeck Karen Blizzard Anonymous Attendee Yes, good question, are we all muted? 4 5 Will there be a time for comments (as opposed to questions)? Karen Blizzard Bill Oliver 6 Who is the selected vendor? Patricia Bobeck 7 Who will enforce the perimeter? Patricia Bobeck 8 Will the No Smoking rule be enforced? If so, by whom? 9 Who is going to monitor whether booze goes outside of this area …. regardless Patricia Bobeck W. Tucker of a “fence”. 10 What kind of glasses will be used to serve beer? glass or plastic? 11 What are the hours of operation for the cafe? Patricia Bobeck David King 12 Who is going to keep inebriated consumers from entering the pool area? Alma Kuttruff 1 Yes. We will have a questions and comments portion at the end of the presentation. Thank you for the question. The selected vendor is Springfed L.L.C, we will provide more information on the vendor later in the presentation. Thank you for the question, Patricia. This question will be addressed later in the presentation. live answered As Christina mentioned, APD will be enforcing this. If your question was not fully answered, you can bring it up during the Q&A portion. live answered live answered. Must be within park hours. Vendor can decide within those. live answered 13 will lifeguards be responsible for removing floks who are drunk from the pool? W. Tucker live answered Zilker Cafe Conditional Use Permit Community Meeting Patricia Bobeck Kelly Besecke live answered Karen Kreps live answered 16 I have never seen anyone enforce the No Smoking rule 14 15 Barton Springs and Zilker Park are already very popular destinations. They get quite crowded, and parking is at a premium. Why does PARD want the cafe to be an additional destination rather than a service to people who are there primarily to enjoy the natural resources? 1. What will be done to prevent parking spaces from being used by diners/drinkers at Spring Fed from taking up scarce parking resources at BSP? 2. How can you justify giving an alcohol license in close proximity to a playscape? 3. Are there no other restaurants nearby (on Barton Springs Road) that serve alcohol? Why put one in over-taxed park resources? 4. With so much public opposition, what is your motivation for approving alcohol sales? 5. How will you police drunk driving out of the parking lot where there are many pedestrians and children playing in the park? 6. How does the CoA benefit from sales of alcohol in Barton Springs? Please elaborate with specifics? 17 Will park police enforce alcohol in/out rules during all hours of operation of the David King live answered cafe? Thank you for having compostable service ware! 18 19 And, it didn’t seem that the park has any problem being a destination. Why the Alma Kuttruff need to sell alcohol to promote more visitors? Karen Blizzard We're happy about that part, too! The varied offerings are a response to current visitors. It may also bring additional people, but it is difficult to know. The primary purpose is to provide additional amenities at the park. 20 21 So will APD be posted at the cafe to enforce the fence rule? If someone goes out, and police are not there, the escapee will be long gone. Is the contract with the concessionaire dependent on approval of the alcohol permit? Will the concessionaire remain even if the alcohol permit is denied? Patricia Bobeck Sam Martin live answered 2 22 You are asking lifeguards to be bouncers now? Anonymous Attendee Zilker Cafe Conditional Use Permit Community Meeting 23 The public needs to know the specific hours of operation of the cafe. David King 24 If an accident or legal infraction occurs that could be related to alcohol consumption, who will be liable? The concessionaire?, COA?, both? Sam Martin 25 Thank you, Heidi, for your question about research into the scientific data associating alcohol consumption and drowning. Karen Kreps 26 What about the liability issue of PARD allowing and promoting the sale of Alma Kuttruff alcohol in the park and at a pool concession stand? 27 please ask the questions that Karen Kreps has asked 28 Why why why??? Other than vendor profits and city revenue(?), who wants W. Tucker Ed Crowell this? Not the lifeguards I’m sure, and I’ve been one who has dealt with beach drunks. We don’t need more pool visitors at 1 million a year now. This is a bad, unnecessary proposal. will exacerbate the lifeguard shortage. 30 And thank you for asking about how what they know about how the lifeguards Karen Kreps feel about pulling drunk people out of the pool. 31 WHY HAVE YOU NOT ASKED THE LIFEGURADS FEEL ABOUT THIS IN THIS W. Tucker 32 SITUATION ????!!!! Is there a reason that the city has not looked at the link between drinking and drowning? Is there a more “important” concern that weighs more heavily than drowning? Patricia Bobeck fantastic question about liability. 33 34 What about alcohol and guns - now that no permits are needed for guns…and W. Tucker Virginia Palmer alcohol at the Springs? 3 The lifeguards are trained to identify inebriated visitors already as well as to identify any food or drink that individuals attempt to bring in. The vendor will be able to determine the hours as long as they are within park hours. Typically, primarily responsibility goes to the offender. If there is negligence in the serving or other aspect, then the responsibility can be shifted. This is always a concern, which is why lifeguards at all pools are trained to identify patrons who may not be at full capacity. 29 Do we not already have a lifeguard shortage? It seems that the additional tasks Patricia Bobeck live answered 35 If the PARD lifeguards respond to survey that they oppose the permit, will PARD drop the request to serve alchohol? Sam Martin Zilker Cafe Conditional Use Permit Community Meeting Just like other projects and programs, PARD staff members are key stakeholders. BSP lifeguards and otehr PARD staff members are invited to also provide comments supporting or against the permitting process. Any surveying will also be shared with the Parks and Recreation Board and Planning Commission, just like the comments here this evening. live answered live answered Yes, feel free to click the 'raise hand' icon if you would like to ask a question. 36 37 38 39 The PARD intent to sell alcohol adjacent to the pool and in a family park area seems to have been promulgated with little concern for safety and well being of family visitors. So will cafe patrons be required to order food to get an alcoholic drink? This meeting is about serving alcohol outside of the pool, not vegan and vegetarian and healthy food. Please stay on track. I never saw the cafe as a “destination” in my twelve of going to the pool. there is already a massive problem with parking at the pool and this will only be excerbated by serving drinks. Alma Kuttruff Patricia Bobeck Heidi Armstrong W. Tucker 41 Can you provide the data source Patricia Rossett stated as there being support Alma Kuttruff times? for alcohol sale in the park? 42 Can community members speak during this meeting? Jennifer Robenalt 43 If the primary responsibility of keeping alcohol within the boundary is with the vendor, then what is the penalty to the vendor if this rule is disobeyed? Daniel Opdyke 44 I missed what Denisha said about the contract. Could you repeat? Patricia Bobeck 40 How long would it take for APD to get to the cafe? Will APD be there at all Patricia Bobeck live answered 4 45 Who gets the proceeds from the cafe sales of alcohol? Jennifer Robenalt Zilker Cafe Conditional Use Permit Community Meeting The agreement with the concessionaire. The get the majority of proceeds. The City's share of revenue goes into the City's general fund, to support all of PARD operations, including pools, however, there is not a specific/direct relationship to the alcohol revenue and support of the pool alone. W. Tucker live answered 46 karen’s questions again:1. What will be done to prevent parking spaces from being used by diners/drinkers at Spring Fed from taking up scarce parking resources at BSP? 2. How can you justify giving an alcohol license in close proximity to a playscape? 3. Are there no other restaurants nearby (on Barton Springs Road) that serve alcohol? Why put one in over-taxed park resources? 4. With so much public opposition, what is your motivation for approving alcohol sales? 5. How will you police drunk driving out of the parking lot where there are many pedestrians and children playing in the park? 6. How does the CoA benefit from sales of alcohol in Barton Springs? Please elaborate with specifics? 47 Please repeat the response to liability issues. I did not hear that addressed Sam Martin 48 49 '“Who is liable” is very different from who will “enforce rules pertaining to alcohol.” The shortage of lifeguards has reduced the public swim by 3 days a week! Karen Kreps Karen Kreps 50 Are we trying to attract even more people to Zilker even with the parking situation and lack of safety personnel by allowing alcohol? There are bars within walking distance. Why are we putting more burdens on an already stretched thin staff? 51 Does it seem likely that with an alcohol-serving cafe next door, there will be Patricia Bobeck more inebriated people entering the pool? I also missed what Denisha said about the contract. Could you repeat? 52 Karen Kreps 5 Jennifer Robenalt live answered Yes, a record of the Q&A chat will be posted on the website. live answered Jennifer, here is the process now. live answered 53 Please respond to Karen Kreps’ question: “How does the CoA benefit from David King live answered sales of alcohol in Barton Springs? Please elaborate with specifics?” Zilker Cafe Conditional Use Permit Community Meeting 54 Will the Q/A chat be included in the recording of this meeting? David King 55 But it never had alcohol service in the past. It is naive to say it will not be a Karen Kreps destination. 56 How can citizens oppose this? What is the process? 57 Why can’t you bring your own food for your kids? 58 Why is it important to bring alcohol to Zilberberg park? 59 typically playscapes near alcohol are part of the business (for example, a brewery with a playscape). My understanding is that TABC prohibits alcohol sales close to schools. Why would a public playscape be different? Jennifer Robenalt Karen Kreps Anonymous Attendee Daniel Opdyke 60 What is the estimated revenue gain to PARD after full implementation of the Sam Martin concession? 61 Please answer my questions #3-6. 62 Barton’s Springs is rowdy without alcohol involved. (And current facility rules don’t allow alcohol or those drinking alcohol to enter) The pool is basically run by about 13 people on a shift, dealing with thousands of folks inside the gates, it can get out of control. Karen Kreps Nichole Bohner 63 Can you provide information on your statement/research that the public Patricia Bobeck supports alcohol adjacent to the playscape and pool? 64 Will additional security or support be provided to the pool to help with issues that arise? Alcohol = even rowdier people. What are the measures being put into place to help them? My experience was that Park Police were support when needed, but they weren’t dedicated to the pool itself and depending on their other calls and workload, they were often slow to respond. I’d suggest dedicated support during busy times if this measure moves forward. Nichole Bohner 65 Are you aware that you’re not answering the questions, or do you really think Anonymous Attendee these constitute answers? Justin - thank you for keeping the focus on the question. 66 67 Please answer our questions as we ask them. You all are being evasive. 68 Does the revenue share go to the general fund or does it benefit the pool? Daniel Opdyke Anonymous Attendee Nichole Bohner live answered 6 Zilker Cafe Conditional Use Permit Community Meeting Patricia Bobeck Jennifer Robenalt 69 70 Is someone implying that vegan food negates the effects of alcohol? This is not a good idea. 1) Public safety. 2) We need more family friendly all ages city spaces. 3) We don’t need it. 4) Parking. 5) Bars are within walking distance. 6) Will attract more darling young people. 7) Why create potential problems where there are none now? 8) do we really need more public intoxication in Austin— especially next to a playground train tracks and a pool? 9) Healthier varied options are great. Why do we need alcohol too? 10) For money the city makes, we will pay for it. 71 So, to get healthy & vegan food options, we have to include alcohol on the menu? Wow! Exactly David King! It’s absurd. 72 73 Can you present the data source for community support of alcohol sales at a public pool? When were the surveys conducted, what was the size of the data pool, what was the demographic sample and did it represent the whole Austin community? Thank you, Kasey (PARD)! 74 75 Will this chat be entered into the formal record of this meeting? 76 So there enough guards for 4 days a week, but not for the normal 6 day a week schedule, right? David King Anonymous Attendee Alma Kuttruff David King Karen Kreps Patricia Bobeck live answered live answered 77 What effect will having alcohol sales at the pool have on people who belong to Karen Kreps AA and are trying to stay sober and coming to the pool for a healthy lifestyle? 78 Karen, I have saved a copy of the chat. 79 Please present the data source for community support of alcohol sales at a Anonymous Attendee Karen Kreps live answered public pool. 80 What was the data source for community support of alcohol sales at a public pool? When were the surveys conducted, what was the size of the data pool, what was the demographic sample and did it represent the entire Austin community? Alma Kuttruff 81 How many people are in attendance? 82 83 I think you’ve missed the question about legal liability If the shorrtage of lifeguards continues, will the Cafe be open while the pool is closed? Karen Kreps Sam Martin Craig Nazor 84 What publicity for future meetings on this topic have been announced? Karen Kreps Where? This is the first I’ve heard of one on next Tuesday. 7 live answered live answered live answered 85 86 87 89 90 Thank you PARD staff for this community engagement meeting! Thank you for your service and hard work for our parks and recreation facilities! David King Zilker Cafe Conditional Use Permit Community Meeting You guys want a song in the comments? I'm still unclear on alcohol leaving the designated area. If the vendor is primarily responsible for this, what will the penalty to the vendor be if it is disobeyed? What ability will they have to enforce if a person refuses? Bill Oliver Daniel Opdyke live answered 88 Has anyone considered the fact that men often behave inappropriately at the Patricia Bobeck pool, even without alcohol? and that with alcohol there will be more inappropriate behavior? I ask because a woman told me the other day that she was exercising pool side and saw a man watching her. She finally figured out he was masturbating while watching her. Does the panel think that this type of behavior will increase with alcohol? If this CUP and license is granted and it results in a death or disability of a patron, what is the process for withdrawing this permit? Why not post full contract on webpage of project instead of a 6 week PIA requet process? The question about next Tuesday’s meeting was about when and where it was announced. Will it be on Zoom? Will a recording of this and future meetings be easilly availalbe to the public, e.g. on a website? Lin Mallardi 91 Please put the URL of the website into the chat room. Karen Kreps Karen Kreps live answered So sorry to hear this. This is such a challenge for our society, and specifically at BSP. This is terrible. I'm not sure that the panel can respond to this without making assumptions that we are not trained in. It is in the general chat, but for reference this is the URL for the project webpage: https://www.austintexas.gov/departmen t/pard-conditional-use-permit- applications 92 Please answer the question about legal liability. 93 PARD staff has listed seemingly all pro reasons / benefits for serving alcohol. Karen Kreps Robert Corbin live answered Surely y'all must have thought of / listed reasons for not serving alcohol. What are the reasons you came up with? Also, I have some comments I would like to publicly make. So if someone drowns in the pool after drinking at the cafe, is the city responsible for the drowing in BSP? 94 95 What will be the capacity limit for the cafe area? Patricia Bobeck live answered Karen Kreps 8 98 We have actual data that say drinking and swimming don't mix: Heidi Armstrong Thank you for providing this information. Thank you for providing that information, Heidi. We are trying our best to get to the questions as quickly as we can. 96 Has a cost analysis been done in order to understand the potential alcohol Jennifer Robenalt sales revenue for the city compared to the resources that will be required to keep the area safe and accessible? 97 Karen, Since they are not directly answering your questions about the meeting, Heidi Armstrong Zilker Cafe Conditional Use Permit Community Meeting I’ll do it. The meetings are announced here: http://austintexas.gov/cityclerk/boards_commissions/meetings/39_1.htm This is agenda item B3. You can email Sammi.Curless@austintexas.gov, the PARD liaison to the Board, with your comments. I’ll be doing the same. Driscoll TR, Harrison JA, Steenkamp M. Review of the role of alcohol in drowning associated with recreational aquatic activity. Injury Prevention 2004;10:107–113. Cummings P, Quan L. Trends in Unintentional Drowning: The Role of Alcohol and Medical Care. JAMA, 1999; 281(23):2198-2202. Read the CDC website about drowning: https://www.cdc.gov/homeandrecreationalsafety/water-safety/waterinjuries- factsheet.html 99 Who are the partners in Springfed LLC? 100 Robert is correct about the lack of law enforcement in our parks. 101 Zilker Park is open from 5 am to 10 pm, 7 days per week. Will the cafe be open Patricia Bobeck Craig Nazor David King with alcohol sales from 5 am to 7 pm, 7 days per week? 102 Is there not also a problem of inebriated people walking on the greenbelt at Karen Kreps the end of the parking lot, where women and children walk alone and must be un-accosted. open from 5AM-10PM, or at least that’s what I conclude. 104 @PARD Kasey — That’s just the beginning. Please examine the data for Heidi Armstrong yourself. You all are making a proposal directly opposed to scientic data and CDC guidelines. There will be physicians speaking at the next meeting. 105 How expensive is this restaurant? Is it really for the public or for the elite? Karen Kreps 9 103 To David King: They said it can be open any time the park is open so it could be Kathleen Magor live answered 111 Why is city staff using public resources talking the lead on trying to push this Anonymous Attendee live answered Rick Garrett and Shawn Cirkiel Zilker Cafe Conditional Use Permit Community Meeting Alma Kuttruff 106 I appreciate the opportunity to comment on this issue. We have so few family gathering areas in Austin and green space ratio per population is diminishing as Austin grows. PARD should have healthy wholesome family enjoyment as the #1 priority. Alcohol sales should not be a part of the PARD agenda for parks. Let’s keep the parks family parks where children can enjoy space, fresh air and whole family activities. 107 Are you saying there is a “community demand” for alcohol at the Springs???? Virginia Palmer 108 Why are you pursuing this? Doesn’t that already show a bias? 109 GREAT COMMENT ALMA ! 110 Good question: Who are the partners in Springfed LLC? Please answer it in the Craig Nazor W. Tucker Karen Kreps Chat room. permit through instead of the concessionaire? 112 From the CDC website: Alcohol Use: Among adolescents and adults, alcohol use is involved in up to 70% of deaths associated with water recreation, almost a quarter of ED visits for drowning, and about one in five reported boating deaths.2,15,17 Alcohol influences balance, coordination, and judgment, and its effects are heightened by sun exposure and heat. Heidi Armstrong 113 If I have one beer with my meal at the cafe, does that mean I'm a danger to the Anonymous Attendee community? visits the park? 114 Are people having a drink at the cafe more dangerous than anyone else who Anonymous Attendee 115 How could you propose this without a cost analysis??? 116 How can the research that is needed be done in the schedule you displayed at Anonymous Attendee Karen Kreps the beginning of this meeting? 117 Wonderful points made about the nature of drunkenness hiding and why are Ed Crowell we creating this situation. One suit from a drowning victim’s family and this would be over. Give us one place without alcohol. 118 Anonyous Attendee, why are you hiding your identify? 119 THe City is so afraid of being sued that it closes the pool when the weather gets below 32 or something liike that. Why is it not afraid of being sued for all the problems that will come from this license to sell booze in the park? Karen Kreps Karen Kreps 120 Yes, please identify the pro-alcohol people. 121 Is Spring Fed a local business or national? Karen Kreps Karen Kreps 10 122 We need good planners running this project and communicating with the Karen Kreps Zilker Cafe Conditional Use Permit Community Meeting public. 123 There are several questions that haven’t been answered or haven’t been answered thoroughly. Who has liability for drowning, injury, violence, or general bad behavior related to drinking at th e cafe? How will the City benefit? What percentage will the City get from the cafe? Will that money go to the pool, PARD, or the general fund? Who and how many are the citizens who are supposedly clamoring to have alcohol at the cafe, and in exactly what way did this idea come from the community rather than Kathleen Magor 124 LOL. I hope Bill Oliver’s new song lyrics about “Barton Drinks Eternal.” 125 Thank you Kam Magor for trying to keep the panelists focused on answering Karen Kreps Karen Kreps the questions. 126 Bill, you are my hero 127 Continued: from PARD staff? When will cost analysis be done showing $ made Kelly Besecke Kathleen Magor from cafe vs extra expenses to manage alcohol-related incidents? 128 bravo Bill! 129 Bravo Bill! 130 You sang it true, Bill. Good job! 131 Is there a reason that there has been no study of the “benefits” of making Daniel Opdyke Craig Nazor Ed Crowell Patricia Bobeck money on alcohol sales and the “disadvantages” of having to spend money on policing the alcohol sales? Is there a reason that there has been no study of the dangers of mixing alcohol and swimming? Does the city not have a standard contract checklist to deal with liability issues such as this? How did these major ideas slip through? 132 How many additional port-a-potties will be required for the beer drinkers now Anonymous Attendee and while the bathhouse be under construction? 133 See repetition of unanswered questions cited above. Karen Kreps 134 Thanks, Bill! 135 Where will the recording of this meeting be available? 136 Please put the URL of the website in this chat room. 137 Pleeae put the URL of the PARD info on this chat room. 138 The agenda is posted but I’m not seeing a way to sign up for the meeting. As in Patricia Bobeck Karen Kreps Karen Kreps Karen Kreps Anonymous Attendee register for a Zoom link. 139 Yes, forgot to ask — does the cafe have a restroom? Patricia Bobeck live answered 11 The video recording will be posted on the project webpage: https://www.austintexas.gov/departmen t/pard-conditional-use-permit- applications You should find it here on the project webpage: https://www.austintexas.gov/departmen t/pard-conditional-use-permit- applications 140 Gee, we get 1 and a half business days to register for comments 141 http://www.austintexas.gov/edims/document.cfm?id=362403 142 Hi Patricia,Thanks for that clarification - we the taxpayers own the park! 143 What about the audio recording? Where can it be seen soon? Karen Kreps Kelly Besecke Patricia Bobeck Karen Kreps Zilker Cafe Conditional Use Permit Community Meeting 144 How can others hear your answers? 145 But who prevents them from entering if they’ve had too much to drink? 146 Where will the recording of this meeting be available? 147 Bill, please do post your lyrics here. 148 Where will the recording of this meeting be available? Karen Kreps Kathleen Magor Karen Kreps Karen Kreps Karen Kreps 149 Where will the recording of this meeting be available? 150 How can the public watch Tuesday’s PARB meeting? 151 Thanks for the song, Bill! You nailed it. 152 So we cannot participate at PARB meeting? 153 I’ve heard no support for this idea throughout the meeting. 154 The Parks Board meeting is streamed live on ATXN. 155 When the bathhouse is closed, and the restaurant is open, how will that work? Craig Nazor Karen Kreps Kelly Besecke Jennifer Robenalt Patricia Bobeck Alma Kuttruff Anonymous Attendee 156 how does one access the chat room? 157 Hey Bill - another verse about drunks in the bathhouse… 158 Who are you Anonymous Attendee? Do you work for the city or represent any Anonymous Attendee Virginia Palmer Karen Kreps BSP group? 159 As to the restroom? Craig Nazor 12